What Pinot Noir Should You Drink If You Love Cabernet? - Pinkies Up Ep. 3

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome everybody to Pinky's Up. This is our third episode, and it's November while we're recording, so we've got Thanksgiving on the mind. And the recommended wine pairing for Turkey is Pinot Noir. And I love Cabernet. So, in case you're new to Pinky's Up, we aim to answer questions that regular people like me have about wine. So tonight we're going to be answering the question: what Pinot Noir should you drink if you're a Cabernet lover? Join us.

SPEAKER_01 0:28

Welcome to Pinkies Up, a series where we answer questions normal wine drinkers like Bridget have about wine. I'm Nick, and I'm here to answer these questions in a way that makes sense, whether you drink your wine with your pinky up or you drink it in a solo cup. Let's see what's going on this month. Hello everybody, it's time for the newest edition of Pinkies Up, our wine series on the Dare Blisterings podcast. And I'm really excited about this one because it's a challenge. What question are we answering today, Bridget?

SPEAKER_00 0:58

So the question we're answering this week is what Pinot Noir should you drink if you are a Cabernet lover?

SPEAKER_01 1:04

So I take this one very personally because I am a Pinot Noir lover. This household, we drink the Pinot Noir, the red Pinot. Thanksgiving is coming up when we are filming this. Yep. And we really highly recommend Pinot Noir as a great Thanksgiving wine. So we Which always makes me nervous. Yeah, so we did a wine pairing video for Light Geneva Country Meats. We can put a link into that if you're interested in that. And it was a bunch of Pinot Noir, and we tried some and uh Bridget.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

Okay, I said it makes me nervous because Nick always tells me to drink Pinot Noir. I'm like I love Cab in case you haven't realized that or put that together. But I will say, I think that we're gonna be able to find a Pinot that I might like, even though I love cab.

SPEAKER_01 1:52

So that's what we're gonna answer. We'll see. Today I have three hypotheses, hypotheses on what way you can find a Pinot Noir for a Cabernet drinker. So I have three answers to the question of what Pinot Noir should a Cabernet drinker try.

SPEAKER_00 2:10

So do you want to know why generally I feel like I don't like Pinot? Yeah, which is BS.

SPEAKER_01 2:14

I think that's a great no, Pinot Noir is a lighter grape. Yes, Cabernet is a heavier grape. So is it just the body?

SPEAKER_00 2:19

Nick is answering my question. Yes, Pinot Noir was the first red wine I started drinking when I started drinking wine. So this is like when you drink the gas station cappuccino and say that you like coffee. Like, no. So I was probably drinking crappy Pinot Noir. So it was like I who knows. Honestly, I don't even remember when I started drinking wine, but it it always felt watery, if you will. I mean, now it feels watery, I should say.

SPEAKER_01 2:42

Um so I knew that would be your thing. So, how do we find something that doesn't taste watery? Hey, regular people like me use proper terms like that. So, no, that's not thin, would be the proper descriptor. So I have three hypotheses. The first one is you should find a Pinot Noir that doesn't taste like Pinot Noir as a Pinot Noir for a Cabernet drinker.

SPEAKER_00 3:05

Okay, so as a Pinot Noir drinker, do you like this one that doesn't actually taste like a Pinot?

SPEAKER_01 3:09

So this is Naomi. It is a huge national brand. You've perhaps had it or heard of it. It got sold for a gajillion dollars. We don't sell at the store, and I'll tell you why. So in America, when something says Pinot Noir, it doesn't have to be 100% Pinot Noir.

SPEAKER_00 3:27

But in other countries it does, and this is American.

SPEAKER_01 3:30

So another question, it kind of varies, and if you see like a single appellation, like if it says oak knoll in Napa Valley, then it has to be 95% of the grape listed. Okay. So right now, this is only 75%. There is Syrah in this box. This is overly extracted. There is Syrah blended in to make this Pinot Noir heavier, more fruity.

SPEAKER_00 3:51

Are you making me drinking out of these proper glasses instead of my pinky pinnacle?

SPEAKER_01 3:54

I don't even have proper glasses this time because.

SPEAKER_00 3:57

That's what I drink out of on this episode. Okay, we'll just leave this here in the foreground for y'all to look at.

SPEAKER_01 4:02

So get Pinot Noir that doesn't taste. Let's see, Bridget, what do you think of Miami?

unknown 4:07

Hmm.

SPEAKER_00 4:07

Okay, um, what would be the most forward flavor in this? Like black currant. Yeah. I taste that a lot. But it's far less thin than um I would be normally used to taste.

SPEAKER_01 4:20

Because they've lended a bunch of grapes that aren't Pinot Noir.

SPEAKER_00 4:22

Honestly, like I don't, yeah. I mean, I wouldn't probably pick this above a cap still. But it does taste less thin. The thing I don't like about Pinot is how thin it tastes. You guys see how well I'm using that term now?

SPEAKER_01 4:35

Pinot Noir got really popular after the movie Sideways because they were all, you know, screw Merlot, drink Pinot Noir. And people actually that shifted from drinking Merlot to Pinot Noir because of the movie still wanted something a little bit more body. So these ones like Miyomy have crap blended in.

SPEAKER_00 4:53

I see that Nick Nick isn't feeling this. Not feeling this Pinot is one of your faves. I like it. It's easy to drink.

SPEAKER_01 5:01

I just There's like petite sera in there too. It's it's got these like eucalyptus-y flavors that have no business being in Pinot Noir. I don't like whatever there is a very forward flavor. There's a lot of like there's a lot of science in this wine. You know, one maybe not very natural. There's a blend of art and science when it comes to making wine. And this one goes more towards science.

SPEAKER_00 5:23

I'm gonna put that right here.

SPEAKER_01 5:25

So but that's one approach, right? You can find a bottle like Miomi. There's a lot of wines that have knocked off this approach. Um, this is a blend of wine from three counties, which is totally cool. That's I'm not gonna knock them for that. They're three very different counties, which I am gonna knock them for that. But you can find wines, yes, very different climates, very different soil types. You know, it's like fusion's cool, but like Polish type fusion is like those things don't really go together. They're very different. Um, so if you see something that's a knockoff of this, there's you can find them. Um but you know, find some pinot noir that has Syrah blended in.

SPEAKER_00 6:01

That's that's one approach. I mean, I would drink that aside a turkey. There you go. But I'm gonna trust that these other two are closer to what I want. Alright. I'm trusting you.

SPEAKER_01 6:08

The second one, so this one I'm actually not sure on. Uh-oh. This is the kind of wild card, and this one's, you know, so find a pinot noir that has a bit more tannin to it. So a bit more of that backbone. And this one's gonna take a little bit more research on your side. Okay. But if you look for something that has what's called whole cluster fermentation, and you'll see that on labels sometimes. Willamette Valley Vineyards has a really popular one. This is Christam, also from Willamette. A lot of people in Oregon are doing this. So, what that means is when you put the berries in your thing to ferment them, and there's different things you can use to ferment them, different types of barrels, uh, instead of having individual berries, you take the whole grape cluster, okay, so the big bunch of grapes, throw it all in, and ferment it that way. That means there's still stems in there. Yep. And so you get some tannin from that. So it gives you a little bit more of that dry structure.

SPEAKER_00 6:57

Do other wines do that?

SPEAKER_01 6:58

Usually just Pinot Noir, because if you go anything heavier than that, it gets a little too much. Oh, okay, actually. So Pinot Noir beeps it up. Beefs it up.

SPEAKER_00 7:07

Someone along the way must have told me to like, hey, if you're just starting to like red wine, start with Pinot Noir, right? I don't know. Someone must have mentioned that somewhere in my life.

SPEAKER_01 7:15

If I don't know how else I would have known to start with. So this comes to us from the Pacific Northwest.

SPEAKER_00 7:19

My fave.

SPEAKER_01 7:20

Bridget's favorite wine region. Uh, Oregon, and it's ecologically friendly, sustainable, all the things, which is great. Oregon does this a lot. So I'm curious what you think of this one and if this is a good approach.

SPEAKER_00 7:31

Um, definitely taste the tannin.

SPEAKER_01 7:34

Um back end.

SPEAKER_00 7:37

I mean, I love it. But it's it is because it's still the other to me. Light embodied, but a lot of tannin on the back. Yes, so this was lighter bodied.

SPEAKER_01 7:47

Oh, yeah, definitely lighter bodied than the meal.

SPEAKER_00 7:49

So, so no. I don't like the blend of like a light body wine, but also too much tannin.

SPEAKER_01 7:54

So, what we're discovering is you just like heavy body.

SPEAKER_00 7:57

Yes, I guess don't we know this? If you're new to Pinky's up, go backwards.

SPEAKER_01 8:01

Bridget likes the heavier body, not the tannin. Yeah, it's a good one. See, I actually thought you kind of liked the tannin.

SPEAKER_00 8:07

No, I think, um, I think it must have been on our October, I don't remember which one, we were talking about this, and I was like, what is that when it's a little too dry on the back end? And just, oh, that's tannin, and I'm like, oh, I don't like that.

SPEAKER_01 8:18

So my first two approaches for addressing the fact that a Cabernet drinker is gonna like something a little heavier, were one, find Cabernet or Pinot Noir that doesn't taste like Pinot Noir, is heavier body, has Syrah, things like that blended in. As a little bit of a strikeout.

SPEAKER_00 8:37

Um, it was better. I would drink that over this one, to be honest.

SPEAKER_01 8:41

My second approach was find a Pinot Noir that has more tannin to it, something that through winemaking techniques, whole cluster fermentation, maybe some more oak aging has tannin to it, that backbone in the cabernet, also a strikeout.

SPEAKER_00 8:56

I mean, you are you are putting up a good fight for Thanksgiving. I don't know what I'm gonna do this year, okay? So you're helping me out.

SPEAKER_01 9:05

I mean, in this one, there's only 400 barrels produced. This one we just tried? Yeah. Wow.

SPEAKER_00 9:11

I I wish I could have I don't know. I mean, none of these are bad. They're just not what I would choose. It's it's I mean, okay, so out of these two, you prefer I shouldn't the one we just drank.

SPEAKER_01 9:22

Yeah, I do. Um, I it's it's a well-made wine. It's got the nice light red berries, it's it's very it's got some savoriness, a little bit of baking spice. It's a very spot entrep. You know what should be. It's nice and enjoyable.

SPEAKER_00 9:33

I just don't understand like the white-bodied wine. I like unless I'm drinking it alongside ice cream. Like, I don't know. I feel like I wanted to stand up to my food.

SPEAKER_01 9:47

Alright, my last approach. I'm very upset. Buy some really freaking expensive Pinot Noir. Perfect. That's a really high quality from a place that makes really big-bodied, really big, big Pinot Noir. We're just gonna love it. Perfectly. So this comes from Burgundy, France, the home of Pinot Noir.

SPEAKER_00 10:08

Why do they make a big-bodied Pinot Noir?

SPEAKER_01 10:11

So this is Pomard. This is a premier cru Pomard. So this means it's a really good vineyard. Sounds like it's a big deal. And Pomard, the soil types and the age of the vines and the sun exposure, along with kind of how it's on a river, all related to a river, situated to a river, uh, all come together to make really big, bold, what we would call masculine styles of Pinot Noir. In Burgundy, you'll get what's sometimes called a feminine style, and sometimes you'll get a masculine. The feminine are from uh appalachians that make uh more aromatic, beautiful, lighter bodied, and the masculine you get big bold.

SPEAKER_00 10:53

Okay, I didn't know like a big bold Pinot existed, because I never would describe Pinot that way. Maybe after this I will. I'm nervous, but I don't like it. I'll turn color. Okay, tune in later to see Nick after he drinks this little bottle. Alright. Ooh. Hum hard. Oh, yeah, much better. There we go! So still lighter than what I'd want. Let me be clear. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 11:27

But what if you're having chicken or turkey? You eat chicken all the time, Bridget. Yeah, but like, you're right.

SPEAKER_00 11:33

I s I don't actually so I don't try and drink wine roast chicken. I drink wine a lot after the kids are in bed. So, like, not necessarily with my meal, but lamenting the day after the kids are asleep and it's a moment of silence. So they're separate. So I want like my delicious wine, almost like my dessert. So it's on its own. But this is I did okay.

SPEAKER_01 11:55

Tell me what you taste in this.

SPEAKER_00 11:56

Okay. Uh-oh. I can't so it's a little, I don't actually want to say this, but the first thing that came to mind was that it was a tiny, tiny bit dry on the end, drier than I'm used to. For sure. Um, for a Pinot, I guess. But again, like I I couldn't even tell you the brand of any Pinot I've had recently, unless it's something you've told me to try. So, um, because I never purchase it. So, this though I could see being delicious at a Thanksgiving dinner. Oh heck yeah. I'm sure, is it because it's the most expensive bottle?

SPEAKER_01 12:30

I mean it's not cheap.

SPEAKER_00 12:31

Right. So, is there a an affordable version that's like a masculine Pinot? No. Are there any good masculine Pinot that are affordable? No, why? Why is that? I mean it is a holiday, so treat yourself, but so let's just do it. Okay, but maybe we don't. I'm saying treat yourself. But what it is there, I mean honestly, is there like an affordable masculine Pinot? Can we think of it?

SPEAKER_01 12:56

No. You know, what Miomi's trying to do is, yeah, this is like $233. Oh, great, great. Um Happy Thanksgiving. Uh it's also very hard to find. Oh Pomard's a very small area, so it it really is a special combination of the the grapevines are very old. Um, the French own the land for a thousand years, so they don't have a mortgage.

SPEAKER_00 13:18

Ah.

SPEAKER_01 13:19

Um, they can do things the way they want. They DGAF about um kind of, you know, in America we chase trends a little bit, and the French are generally a little bit more. My father did it this way, and his father did it that way, and my father did it. We are right. So um, you know, you you can find red burgundy that's less expensive than this. It's Pomard really is a special place for making Pinot Noir. If you like Pinot Noir, you deserve to at some point buy some cremier crew fruit from Pomard, Bone. Uh, some of the, I don't want to say more affordable, because it's not affordable. More affordable than more affordable than like Romani Conti, which sells for like $1,500 a bottle. Okay. Um it's all relevant. But you owe it yourself to try some of these different appalacians and um these different villages and see exactly what the quality buys you. Is this $100 better than the $30 bottle of burgundy? No, it's not.

SPEAKER_00 14:25

But I mean I am a is it significantly better?

SPEAKER_01 14:28

Heck yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:29

Yeah, I would honestly I wish I could like mix the body of the Naomi but with the better taste and flavors of this. Um, but you know, that would be weird to put two wines in one glass.

SPEAKER_01 14:40

Once you start chasing that body, you you just lose all the delicate because there's floral notes in this, there's there's a lot going on.

SPEAKER_00 14:48

This is so much more lovely, you know. That's the way the regular people would describe it.

SPEAKER_01 14:52

There's there's, you know, three, three different layers of flavor going on. There's some initial berries, then you get because I get like fresh, and this will this wine will age for 15, 20 years, no problem. So originally I get like some fresh red berry still, and um, then you get some like compote and baked fruits that kind of mid-palette evolve across it. And then on the end, you definitely get a little bit. This is some time in oak, uh neutral oak, but you get a little bit of that oak spice baking spices, and aromatically, I mean it's berry, and there's some floral in there, which is nice.

SPEAKER_00 15:25

I think it's it's really yeah, it's I am consistently um I don't know, intrigued or impressed by how different, like this is all Pinot Noir. So I would not I don't like I haven't done a proper wine tasting since four of them shut down, but like these are so different, all three of these wines, completely different. So make this taught me so much of that.

SPEAKER_01 15:44

Here, let's bring out our world atlas of wine.

SPEAKER_00 15:46

Oh boy. But I mean, and it's all really well it's the region and the grape and the way they're they're processed, if you will. They're processed. The process. Guys, we are straight up looking up, yeah, an atlas here. What are you showing me?

SPEAKER_01 16:04

Trying to find. They have this laid out weird.

SPEAKER_00 16:09

Is this elevation? We're looking at what, like topography here?

SPEAKER_01 16:12

Yep, so this is this is Popeurin. And you can see uh people, Nick. There's there's a river over there.

SPEAKER_00 16:19

It's very nice, very tiny map.

SPEAKER_01 16:21

It's on, it's on I'll even call Jancis Robinson a masker if we can publish this to you. Oh, it's kind of a big deal. But you can see there's this huge hill that's you know protects it from it's a very special place. Look how tiny this thing is.

SPEAKER_00 16:37

It's very small. It makes the best Pinot Noir out of the house.

SPEAKER_01 16:40

All this premier crew, it came from right here. This vineyard. It's on the map.

SPEAKER_00 16:45

Okay, buddy. So if you're not sure what to drink for Thanksgiving, Nick suggests Pinot Noir. We have a really great I mean, honestly, you make me nervous. I think this is the second year I've asked you, at least, maybe longer, what I should drink, and you always tell me Pinot Noir, and then I always panic.

SPEAKER_01 16:59

I think I brought Syrah last year. We went, we don't remember. We went a little nuts at Friendsgiving last year.

SPEAKER_00 17:06

Yep, yeah, it was good. We're gonna do this year. Can we even can we do Friends? You're in my bubble, so but also sparkling wine.

SPEAKER_01 17:12

Yep, sparkling wine. You know, you could buy uh all Pinot Noir, you could do a Blanc de Noirs, and that's gonna be all Pinot Noir. I mean, I hate to pull this trick again, but maybe just buy someone, especially like Bridget, just buy her a Blanc de Blanc de Noir, and uh you know, there you go.

SPEAKER_00 17:31

Just pull in this trick. Or, you know, do this, have a little tasting. I don't know, this would be really interesting to eat alongside turkey because they're so different. Which one would be your choice? This one, um, because it's your favorite.

SPEAKER_01 17:42

But specifically I mean the Kristum. Miomi is not good with food. Like, it is just straight up because there's like so many flavors. I mean it's so sticky and flavorful. Yeah, unctuous. It's it's not there's very little um acidity in it. And any wine that's good with food is gonna have a lot of acidity. Sheeping your sick corner. Okay, yeah. Um yeah, so I would not recommend the Miomi with the food ever at all. Never. Okay. There's a reason we don't sell it, which honestly is because the premise of our wine set is everything needs to go with food. Even disgustingly sweet wine can go with food if it's done.

SPEAKER_00 18:25

We learned a little bit of that. Wow. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:28

However, wine that's just based on being like some huge fruit bomb just doesn't work with food. Fair enough. Alright, so Bridget, give me the verdict. So, guys. What Pinot Noir should you buy for Cabernet drinking?

SPEAKER_00 18:44

If you love cab, well, guys, I guess we are buying the most expensive bottle, as always.

SPEAKER_01 18:50

But really, is the end result just buy a buy a cabernet because it ain't gonna work no matter what.

SPEAKER_00 18:55

I'm gonna be drinking Cabernet on Thanksgiving. Um, you know what? Yeah, I'm probably gonna stick with cab, I'll be honest. But you have opened my eyes, but still taught me that penal grapes are a little too light for my liking.

SPEAKER_01 19:08

Thank you for letting me down gently, Bridget. Sorry, man. I appreciate it. I feel like I put my best swing at it. Yeah, I gave it a try.

SPEAKER_00 19:16

I do like the $130 bottle, of course, but I didn't pay that much for it.

SPEAKER_01 19:20

I want to be clear, I bought it on pre-buy, direct import, personal purchase, because I know some people. But on the internet it's selling for $130.

SPEAKER_00 19:30

So you can enjoy that, it's very good, or you can buy a cab.

SPEAKER_01 19:36

You can do that. You can do that.

SPEAKER_00 19:39

I appreciate the effort, Nick. Means a lot. One day. One day, we'll meet on a common ground with Pinot Noir.

SPEAKER_01 19:45

Maybe we should do a Merlot tasting and just you know.

SPEAKER_00 19:48

Actually, I am very curious to like go back to Merlot because again, growing up, Merlot was like our old people, but I think I'm old people now.

SPEAKER_01 19:56

Next October, we're gonna do Merlot, uh, because October is Merlot month. Oh yeah. They have a hashtag, it's called hashtag Merlot Meat. Really? Oh yeah, yes, I've seen that floating around. But we're very busy with Oktoberfest in October. Very busy with Oktoberfest. But I think uh next October we should do some Merlot's. Uh I love Merlot. Uh, we're really deep in it on our cellar. So, you know, we gotta drink that sometimes.

SPEAKER_00 20:18

I do need to um expand my Merlot knowledge.

SPEAKER_01 20:21

So it's a great grape. It and it ripens more reliably than Cabernet, which means climate change is not a well. Alright, everybody, thank you so much for tuning in, Bridget. I'm sorry, I failed to. If you love Pinot, we'd love to know what your favorite Pinot is. Have you ever tricked a Cabernet drinker into drinking Pinot? Specifically, that's what we want to know. So I can try it. I thought about buying you Pinotage, which is the world's worst grape.

SPEAKER_00 20:50

It's like it sounds terrible.

SPEAKER_01 20:52

It's not made up. I'm sorry, a hybrid of Pinot Noir and Sinseau. And it's a dumpster fire. Great, thank you. So, but it's got some Pinot Noir in it, and it's like really kind of tastes like Cabernet, kind of.

SPEAKER_00 21:06

Why is it a dumpster? Are you telling me I like dumpster fire wine?

SPEAKER_01 21:09

Well, because it was made in South Africa when there was apartheid and they wanted something heavier bodied, and they couldn't get any real Cabernet because they were they were being embargoed by the rest of the world. Um but, you know. Stay tuned, guys. Stay tuned.

SPEAKER_00 21:25

Thanks for listening in.